HP5 Plus 400 and DD-X

Paul Lange

Paul Lange

Moderator
I have just developed some HP5 Plus with DD-X and the results were much grainier than I expected. I had a look on the internet and saw quite a bit of info about it. I could'n find much to compare the actual images. Here are 2 (below). Does the level of grain seem about right, they seem very grainy to me.

What happens when developer begins to expire, can expired developer increase grain?

BTW, the white mush in the first is falling snow.


The River in Snow-time.jpg by Paul R Lange, on Flickr






Lock.jpg by Paul R Lange, on Flickr
 
It is hard to tell from the first but looking at the second it is probably about right. Extending development tends to increase the size of grain and so I would expect a slightly weak developer not to.

I really like that first shot Paul. Shame about the highlight. Maybe a crop?
 
The FE only has average metering (I think). I metered the sky and then added +1EV. I thought higher might blow out some of the finer branches but I wasn't expecting so much grain. It seems to make the highlights more grey and the shadows too for that matter!
 
They do look grainy, Paul, though both are interesting. I'm not familiar with that developer so I don't know if its about the right amount of grain or not. But they do look rather grainy. I think Nihat's recent image of Malibu Creek was this same developer and it didn't look grainy like these. (Granted, I think Nihat was using large format so that may explain the difference.)

Besides what Pete said,...Higher temps increase grain, also, I think. So too, can your agitation regimen.
 
I don't think I would have expected that much grain from this combo ... ... I was just trying to find a shot or two that I could pin point as having used this combo. I just can't think. I did a lot of pushing of hp5 with ddx and can only ever remember being supprised how smooth the images were ...
 
I used a 1 to 4 mixture of DDX at 20 degrees for 9 minutes inverting every minute. I found this info on Ilfords documentation. There was something odd with the film though, after developing there was a sticky residue on the film. Also there were some stringy pieces of geletine that had come off the film. With the other half of the batch I mixed I also developed the HP5 in the Fuji GS645S. This didn't have the same issues but I can't check for graininess easily as I dont have a 120 film scanner.

Thanks for the comments on the photos. The first one I quite like but was hoping for something less grainy. The second I am not so sure about but it was from the same roll but seemed to have less grain. It just happen to illustrate the issue well.
 
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Ah, he curse of the small format scanner ... A problem I know all to well at the moment!

what were the first couple of frames I took of then?
I was thinking about what they might be ... The only thing I could think is that they would have been of the inside of my attic room. As one of my more valued cameras I did periodically test it. If I hadn't realised there was a film in I've probably taken photos of the window frame?
 
I used Ilfostop - 10 seconds and then Rapid Fixer 2.5 minutes.

More searching on the web revealed not very much other than a suggestion that too much wetting agent may have been added to the wash. As you suggested Pete I use de-ionised water for the final rinse and I did add some wetting agent.
 
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That all sounds fine and you'd need to add a hell of a lot of wetting agent to damage the film.

As for the seemingly enhanced grain, I'm really not sure why that has occurred given what you did. However, it is grain? How did you wash the film? I assume your film went from room temperature into the dev, stop and fix all at about 20ºC. But what about the temperature of the wash? If it was running tap water, how quickly did it go from room temperature to very cold (or too hot even - that might cause the stringing you saw). Is the 'noise' you are seeing reticulation, (ie fine crazing of the gelatine) rather than grain? How about trying to take a macro shot of a part of a negative to see if it is silver or just crazing?
 
I had a look under my trusty 30x pocket microscope and it did not appear to be crazing. By crazing I assume you mean soething similar to the decorative paint finish when you apply a second coat with a different drying characteristic to the first cat before it has fully dried? The neg just seemed to have a very pronounced grain. I did wash the negs in cold water though. Maybe this didnt help!
 
Paul,...I'm not sure the first image actually has more grain than the second. The second seems to have more contrast, though, and this may be "hiding" the grain a little. They sure look grainy, though. They even look a little like digital images to which "film grain" has been added in PP. (At least to me.)

By the way, I like that first image a lot.
 
Just for reference here is a link to someones Flickr photo, same film, developer and process. It is quite grainy but has a lot more contrast. If the difference in grain between my 1st and 2nd images is just a perceived effect that is masked by higher contrast I guess it makes sense?
 
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