Apps to record metadata

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

I’ve used a variety of tools over the years to record metadata on the shots I take with my film cameras. I started with a “hipster PDA” (aka a pile of index cards held together with a binder clip), fancy notebooks, and most recently the NOSSAFLEX app. I’m pretty unhappy with all of these options for a range of reasons.

So I decided to create a new app that would address my own needs.

Before I say anything at all about this app, I should say: It’s obviously designed to address my own particular needs, but it would be much better if it was addressing the needs of a larger audience than just me!

So I’m curious to know: What do you use to record metadata, and what do you wish could be improved about the process (that can be addressed by a mobile app, specifically)?

For my own self, what I find important are things like the following:
-optimized for left-handed use because my camera is in my rightnhand
-it needs to have a light meter built in
-data entry needs to be very quick
-which means the app needs to know about the equipment I own so that it can suggest shutter speed / aperture combinations that are actually possible on that equipment, and not merely ideal.

But what about you? Here’s your chance to help design an app you would find useful. What do you like about your current process? What could be improved? What’s your wishlist?

Looking forward to hearing what you have to share!

 

[Brian Moore]

I'm clearly not as visionary as you, Don. My metadata consists merely of my scribbles on the negative sleeves: Camera, date, location, developer, and scanned file name. I'll often write the film type (usually this is a redundancy) and anything unique ("expired" or "redscale" for example.)

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

I'm clearly not as visionary as you, Don. My metadata consists merely of my scribbles on the negative sleeves: Camera, date, location, developer, and scanned file name. I'll often write the film type (usually this is a redundancy) and anything unique ("expired" or "redscale" for example.)

What I’ve always done is number each sleeve and put the data you mention on an index card (with the correlating sleeve number) that I tuck into the binder. So, now that you mention it, it’s important my app can print such sheets for me.

 

[Chris Bennett]

I do the same as Brian.
Since having much more detailed frame by frame metadata made available to me by digital photos, I've often regretted that the same info isn't recorded for film work. So it would be great to have it. The trouble is that what would be required to get this data logged is way more than I would be prepared to devote time to at the time of shooting. When that moment has gone, I stand zero chance of remembering what the f-stop or shutter speed was.
As such, I'm resigned to leaving things as they are.

 

[Pete Askew]

I do the same for negatives and keep it on the sleeve, but rarely include much more than the camera used. My old work ones were also indexed. I only record settings for sheet film (and occasionally a roll of 120). Work shots are always accompanied by a record sheet with settings on (mainly for the microscope, stand, etc being used) and details of the specimen in each shot.

For certain prints though I will make a detailed record as shown here:

F-Stop Printing and the Image Map

Some time ago I posted an image taken from a boat in Copenhagen. I thought it might be interesting to show part of the process that lead to the final print and show how this is actually quite similar to what many of us do with a digital workflow. Leading up to the point shown in the following...

realphotographersforum.com

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

I do the same as Brian.
Since having much more detailed frame by frame metadata made available to me by digital photos, I've often regretted that the same info isn't recorded for film work. So it would be great to have it. The trouble is that what would be required to get this data logged is way more than I would be prepared to devote time to at the time of shooting. When that moment has gone, I stand zero chance of remembering what the f-stop or shutter speed was.
As such, I'm resigned to leaving things as they are.

This is why I gave up writing out notes by hand. Takes far too long. I'm trying to get the nuisance factor down to well inside "tolerable" with this app—so that it's only slightly more bothersome than using an external meter (which for most of my work I'm doing anyway). I can imagine that with an auto-exposure camera, doing any kind of recording becomes bothersome, and there's little an app designer can do to reduce that annoyance.

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

I do the same for negatives and keep it on the sleeve, but rarely include much more than the camera used. My old work ones were also indexed. I only record settings for sheet film (and occasionally a roll of 120). Work shots are always accompanied by a record sheet with settings on (mainly for the microscope, stand, etc being used) and details of the specimen in each shot.

For certain prints though I will make a detailed record as shown here:

F-Stop Printing and the Image Map

Some time ago I posted an image taken from a boat in Copenhagen. I thought it might be interesting to show part of the process that lead to the final print and show how this is actually quite similar to what many of us do with a digital workflow. Leading up to the point shown in the following...

realphotographersforum.com

Oh yeah, for printmaking, meticulous notes are a must. And screens that can turn on unexpectedly are very unwelcome! Nevermind that simply drawing on a proof is far more succinct than any app can offer.

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

So far, the sentiment seems to be uninterested, because any kind of metadata collection is too much bother. And that's fair—we have to ask ourselves how useful this is to each of us! And if it's not useful, then I'm not solving your problem, just creating new ones

For my own part, I prefer having detailed notes so that I can learn from each negative, and get to know my equipment better. It's easy with digital, but for example I've only just recently learned how bad one of my analog lenses is wide open because I had the notes (and sufficient photographic samples) to make the observation.

I'm curious to hear from others who are making notes, or are interested in keeping notes.

 

[Stevenson Gawen]

So far, the sentiment seems to be uninterested, because any kind of metadata collection is too much bother. And that's fair—we have to ask ourselves how useful this is to each of us! And if it's not useful, then I'm not solving your problem, just creating new ones

For my own part, I prefer having detailed notes so that I can learn from each negative, and get to know my equipment better. It's easy with digital, but for example I've only just recently learned how bad one of my analog lenses is wide open because I had the notes (and sufficient photographic samples) to make the observation.

I'm curious to hear from others who are making notes, or are interested in keeping notes.

I must confess that I'm another un-note-keeper I'm afraid. I like the idea, though. Part of my issue is that I don't shoot enough film... my photography is probably about 90% digital is not more. Which is probably why I'm not better at using film. No improvement without practice But I just don't seem to get that enthused by analogue at present..

Anyway, long way to say sorry for not being helpful. But I'd say go for it anyway!

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

I appreciate the responses!

I've made a typeform to collect future responses in a more rigorous way. I'd love your feedback!

Taking notes and shooting film

Turn data collection into an experience with Typeform. Create beautiful online forms, surveys, quizzes, and so much more. Try it for FREE.

66dyx6cdwle.typeform.com

 

[Stevenson Gawen]

Looks good to me! I filled it in, and didn't have any 'um... that doesn't fit' moments, so the form gets a thumbs up from me

 

[Brian Moore]

Filled it in.

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

Much appreciated y’all!

 

[Pete Askew]

Also done. The only question I had a problem with is the number of rolls. I used to shoot sometimes 20 rolls a day or more whereas these days I rarely shoot 35mm film and only occasionally 120. Although I have been quiet for the last couple of years, I do still shoot 5x4 and have recently been using a fair bit of instant film.

 

[Brian Moore]

Also done. The only question I had a problem with is the number of rolls. I used to shoot sometimes 20 rolls a day or more whereas these days I rarely shoot 35mm film and only occasionally 120. Although I have been quiet for the last couple of years, I do still shoot 5x4 and have recently been using a fair bit of instant film.

I had similar thoughts on that question Pete. Since I moved to Washington state a couple of years ago I don’t shoot nearly as much film as I once did.

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

Also done. The only question I had a problem with is the number of rolls. I used to shoot sometimes 20 rolls a day or more whereas these days I rarely shoot 35mm film and only occasionally 120. Although I have been quiet for the last couple of years, I do still shoot 5x4 and have recently been using a fair bit of instant film.

Right, of course I wasn't thinking about sheet film or instant film in my questions, so my question was not well worded. Thanks for pointing that out!

 

[Stevenson Gawen]

Just wanted to say congrats @Don Goodman-Wilson !

Review of the Crown + Flint Mobile App for Film Photographers: Simple, Intuitive, and Helpful

My favorite thing about the Crown and Flint app is that it is designed to work with a photographer’s workflow. It just makes sense.

www.35mmc.com

I know I wasn't any help to you regarding the app - my analogue photography is still very dormant at present - but I'm really glad you did what you wanted to do, and it's looking pretty popular.

 

[Don Goodman-Wilson]

Just wanted to bump this, as I'm soon to release the third major revision to the app! I'm always looking for feedback, and I need some Android beta testers still, if there's any interest here.

Anyway, R3 is an overhaul to the way film collections are handled, specifically the film sitting in storage somewhere. Crown + Flint will now allow you to track not only individual rolls and sheets, but boxes of sheets, and bulk rolls. It also streamlines the process of moving film from storage into a camera, including the new ability to handle cameras with interchangeable backs. Pretty excited about it, and I'll have some media highlighting the new features on our Instagram page soon.

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[Erik Brammer]

Android users, come on and join! The Crown + Flint community in general and its beta testing community in particular is great.

 

[Gary R. Smith]

I'm curious to hear from others who are making notes, or are interested in keeping notes.

Hi Don,
I started shooting film in 1970 or '71 and I don't recall keeping notes. I didn't keep notes in my darkroom either. For a long time I didn't shoot anything then some 12 years ago or so I got roped back into photography (I replaced a guy at a company and one of his "other duties as required" was being the photographer). I've acquired a pile of digital cameras and find that when looking at other photos I like to see the exif data. I had a recent brush with a Mamiya m645 with a non-working meter in the PD finder so for that roll I shot the same scene with a gx9. These days I rarely shoot film but having an easy way to map the shutter/aperture and ISO to an exposure would be handy. The 2 film cameras that I use most have working meters. Does your app also include a way to record voice input?