Before DSLR landscape photos

[Katherine Lihou]

I’m still working on understanding the new Mac and LR so that I can post some macros, but since I also want to learn how to take landscapes (and especially sea and cloudscapes) with a DSLR camera, and will be soliciting help and criticism in future, I thought I’d show you where I’m starting from as well as some of the landscape around here. All snaps taken with much-loved Fuji compacts on auto and endlessly fiddled about with using free apps

I’ve looked through a lot of the landscapes here and they’re so impressive that they’ve given me something inspiring to aim for. I’d love to learn how to capture light the way you can.

Looking at these old photos with new eyes I’m thinking that one of the first things I’ll have to learn is how to use GND filters, either real or virtual. I know there’s no substitute for CPL’s and ND filters as yet but some people say that there’s no need for GND filters either anymore as it can all be done in PS. But there are so many good photographers out there still using GND filters that I can’t believe PS can give the same results. I’d be very grateful for advice about that.

If these photos fail to appear it means that I’ve failed at my first attempt to use Photobucket ....still unsure about this resizing business....

Kate

 

[Rudi Venter]

Hi Kate!

Some nice photos, love the colors in the last two! You have some impressive scenery in your part of the world!

The only filters I use these days are a CP, ND Grad and a 8 stop ND. Even these I use rather seldom, only when I am trying to create something special like movement/blurring in water when there is a lot of light or when the dynamic range of the image is really huge. The CP works well for removing reflections.

I think all the warming and other color filters are redundant these days, far easier to do it with the RAW processing software or in PS. Even the ND Grad's can be very effectively replaced with a single RAW capture and HDR techniques.

Once you start shooting landscapes with a DSLR you will never look back!

Have fun!
Rudi

 

[Ralph Thornton]

Kate,
You've got some nice work there. I use a CP filter fairly often and carry an ND 8. I find about the only time I use the ND filter though is when photographing waterfalls or streams when I want to use a longer shutter speed to blur the water flow. I agree with Rudi that warming and other color filters are not needed. You can add these effects is post processing if you want. The main thing, I believe, is to shot RAW so that you have the most info to work with in your photo.

Dynamic Range or lack thereof is one of the biggest problems in landscape photography IMO. I find myself frequently taking at least 3 exposures of a scene so that I can blend them later using Photomatix. Sometimes, I just process a single RAW file with 3 or more different exposures and combine them with Photomatix. Using the one file is not as good as 3 separate exposure but it often helps recover darker areas as long at the bright areas are not blown out.

I spent years shooting with film but the new DSLR cameras sure make photography more fun.

 

[Chris Dodkin]

Kate - love the wave action you've captured, very dramatic and great timing in that first shot.

Also the sunset colours in the last two - very nice.

RE Filters - CP and ND like the other folks here - I do my ND grads in Photoshop's RAW processor these days, and that can really be useful.

I want to mention something about your new camera which will assist in landscape photography.

Live mode on the 5D2 has transformed my landscape work - the ability to frame up the shot on the screen rather than through the viewfinder, the ability to get a live histogram as well, and then adjust my exposure to get the best histogram has transformed my exposure accuracy.

Also the ability to overlay the 3rds grid on that screen has really assisted composition.

This has meant that I'm using the tripod all the time - but that has really helped with image quality and composition - I'm using narrower apertures with more DOF, longer exposures, and lower ISO settings.

I'm also using my shutter release cable all the time now. That plus the mirror lock up feature inherent in Live View has really sharpened up the final images.

If you're already using this method then you'll know - if you're not, then I'd really recommend giving it a try.

 

[Katherine Lihou]

Hi Kate!

Some nice photos, love the colors in the last two! You have some impressive scenery in your part of the world!

It’s a stunning archipelago, and apart from the interestingly unpredicatable weather and light we also have a huge tidal range of around 10m which makes the islands grow and shrink twice a day offering endlessly changing patterns on the shores.

The only filters I use these days are a CP, ND Grad and a 8 stop ND. Even these I use rather seldom, only when I am trying to create something special like movement/blurring in water when there is a lot of light or when the dynamic range of the image is really huge. The CP works well for removing reflections.

For the Canon 17- 40L I bought a B&W CPL and 3 stop ND but haven’t used them yet. I’m suffering from the worldwide shortage of 10-stop ND’s and will have to wait for that one After reading the good advice on this thread I’m now holding off from buying GND’s until I can see what I can do in PP.

I think all the warming and other color filters are redundant these days, far easier to do it with the RAW processing software or in PS. Even the ND Grad's can be very effectively replaced with a single RAW capture and HDR techniques.

I’ve heard about using single RAW captures for HDR but never tried.
I don’t have any dedicated HDR software and am trying not to touch CS5 until I fully understand how to use LR3, but how does single or multiple-capture HDR in PS compare to something like Photomatix, for instance?

Once you start shooting landscapes with a DSLR you will never look back!

I haven't the slightest doubt that you're right I really miss the freedom of just having a small compact in my pocket but there’s no going back once you’ve seen what DSLR’s can do I’ve seen the difference when taking macros with the 450D and am really looking forward to trying those first landscapes with a 5D mk II

Cheers,

Kate

 

[Katherine Lihou]

Kate,
You've got some nice work there. I use a CP filter fairly often and carry an ND 8. I find about the only time I use the ND filter though is when photographing waterfalls or streams when I want to use a longer shutter speed to blur the water flow. I agree with Rudi that warming and other color filters are not needed. You can add these effects is post processing if you want. The main thing, I believe, is to shot RAW so that you have the most info to work with in your photo.

Thanks so much for the advice Ralph. I’ll be learning how to use a CP and a couple of ND’s very soon. We only have a few streams onland but I'm looking forward to using the ND's on the sea. When using a cp do I have to keep the sun at around 90 degrees to the way the lens is facing to get the best out of it?

Dynamic Range or lack thereof is one of the biggest problems in landscape photography IMO. I find myself frequently taking at least 3 exposures of a scene so that I can blend them later using Photomatix. Sometimes, I just process a single RAW file with 3 or more different exposures and combine them with Photomatix. Using the one file is not as good as 3 separate exposure but it often helps recover darker areas as long at the bright areas are not blown out.

I've seen a lot of HDR photos and found many of them too harsh. I only recently realised that they can be used to create very naturalistic results. Looking at your photos it's obvious that you've mastered the latter technique

In LR I'm learning that fiddling with exposure and the recovery sliders can only so so much so I'll definitely give HDR a try. Would you say that Photomatix is the best software for it?

I spent years shooting with film but the new DSLR cameras sure make photography more fun.

I completely agree. I had a pretty nice film camera for years but hardly used it because I was too poor to afford the processing. DSLR’s makes photography more fun in so many ways

Cheers,

Kate

 

[Katherine Lihou]

Kate - love the wave action you've captured, very dramatic and great timing in that first shot.

Not minding getting wet is the key

RE Filters - CP and ND like the other folks here - I do my ND grads in Photoshop's RAW processor these days, and that can really be useful.

I’ll have to see what it can do. I’m working on learning LR3 first. I have CS5 but no CR experience at all. Is there much difference between graduated filters in LR and CR?

I want to mention something about your new camera which will assist in landscape photography.

Live mode on the 5D2 has transformed my landscape work - the ability to frame up the shot on the screen rather than through the viewfinder, the ability to get a live histogram as well, and then adjust my exposure to get the best histogram has transformed my exposure accuracy.

Now that’s interesting. When using the Fuji compacts I had to use live view all the time. With the 450D and 5D mk II I only used them for macro so I used the viewfinder exclusively because it’s the only way to get a really sharp focus, especially with such a narrow DOF (I work without flash). I don’t even know how to switch to live view on either of them so I’ll get the manual out again and have a practice in the garden.

I do like using histograms between shots to check on what I’ve done, but only when my subjects aren’t in too much of a hurry

Also the ability to overlay the 3rds grid on that screen has really assisted composition.

Thanks once again as I didn’t know you could do that in live view. I wouldn’t use it in macro work as insects have a pitiful disdain for the rules of composition and would tend to wander recklessly all over the grid, but I think it would be invaluable when doing landscapes so I’ll definitely experiment with it

This has meant that I'm using the tripod all the time - but that has really helped with image quality and composition - I'm using narrower apertures with more DOF, longer exposures, and lower ISO settings.

A tripod. Yes. I can see all the advantages of one. I bought a beautiful Manfrotto carbon fibre one but have only ever used it for macro work indoors. It’s so bulky and hard to transport.

I’ve never wanted a car so I’m working out a way to get it on my bicycle. Bunjee cords I’m thinking. But the biggest problem is how to transport it from there. I like getting out on the rocks and need two hands to hold on with and nothing on my back that would move around and destabilise me (300' cliffs and all that ). I’ve been looking at various camera bags but the reviews all say that the tripod-holding parts aren’t really up to the job. Can you recommend the best way? I like rucksacks but can't see how to secure a large tripod to one.

I'm also using my shutter release cable all the time now. That plus the mirror lock up feature inherent in Live View has really sharpened up the final images.

I use a shutter release for indoor macro and am happy to take it out for landscapes. I understand the principle of mirror lock up but haven't tried it. I'm wondering if macro photographers ever use it as I've never heard it mentioned....

If you're already using this method then you'll know - if you're not, then I'd really recommend giving it a try.

I will indeed You've given me some very useful pointers there and I thank you for it. I'll be getting out next week to try DSLR landscape for the first time and will put some of the results up for critique (that section of the forum looks very quiet at the moment). Do NOT be gentle with me. I'm badly in need of knowing exactly what I'm doing wrong

Cheers,

Kate

 

[Ralph Thornton]

Thanks so much for the advice Ralph. I’ll be learning how to use a CP and a couple of ND’s very soon. We only have a few streams onland but I'm looking forward to using the ND's on the sea. When using a cp do I have to keep the sun at around 90 degrees to the way the lens is facing to get the best out of it?

As far as the sky goes 90 degrees to the sun is where the effect of polarization is at its maximum. But sometimes maximum polarization is too much. In any case put the CP filter on and compose a scene then rotate the filter to see what effect you get.

The CP filter will cut the reflections off of leaves and water too and that's one of its primary uses for me.

I've seen a lot of HDR photos and found many of them too harsh. I only recently realised that they can be used to create very naturalistic results. Looking at your photos it's obvious that you've mastered the latter technique

In LR I'm learning that fiddling with exposure and the recovery sliders can only so so much so I'll definitely give HDR a try. Would you say that Photomatix is the best software for it?

I definitely agree that an HDR treatment can give some harsh or surreal results. For my landscape work I want to keep the scene looking as natural as possible while at the same time bringing up the details in shadows and keeping the details in the brightly lit areas.

As far as the best software goes, I'm not an expert there. I use PhotoShop CS2 and it has an HDR feature but it doesn't work on my computer for some reason. I purchased Photomatix Light at a reasonable cost and it seems to do the trick for me.
Ralph

 

[Ralph Thornton]

I think all the warming and other color filters are redundant these days, far easier to do it with the RAW processing software or in PS. Even the ND Grad's can be very effectively replaced with a single RAW capture and HDR techniques.

I’ve heard about using single RAW captures for HDR but never tried.
I don’t have any dedicated HDR software and am trying not to touch CS5 until I fully understand how to use LR3, but how does single or multiple-capture HDR in PS compare to something like Photomatix, for instance?

I shoot RAW. Then I open the file in DPP (Canon's Digital Photo Professional). I process the Raw file into a tiff file three times, one with the exposure decreased by up to 2 stops, one normal and one with the exposure increased by up to 2 stops. I then use those 3 tiff files to create the HDR image.

BTW, Photoshop CS 2 has an HDR capability (but for some reason I've never got it to work on my computer). If you have PS CS5 (or any version from CS2 and up you should be able to use PS to do some HDR work. On CS2 the command is under:
File--> Automate--> Merge to HDR

 

[Chris Dodkin]

Kate - the good thing about the Live View mode on the Canons - is that it automatically does mirror lock-up for you.

So you don't even have to think about it.

The Live View histogram is also unique, in that you can see the histogram 'live', not just between shots - so as you compose the shot and wait for the light to change, you can see how the exposure is effected. It means that you can really fine tune your exposure compensation before taking the shot - really useful.

For landscapes it's perfect - for fast targets, not so much!

Not sure of the best solution for carrying the tripod - I always end up with it over one shoulder, but it sounds like the terrain you have will demand you have both hands free!

Maybe someone else has a backback solution that can lock-down a tripod?

 

[Katherine Lihou]

As far as the sky goes 90 degrees to the sun is where the effect of polarization is at its maximum. But sometimes maximum polarization is too much. In any case put the CP filter on and compose a scene then rotate the filter to see what effect you get.

Thanks. I will. Practising with it is the best way to learn, I agree.

The CP filter will cut the reflections off of leaves and water too and that's one of its primary uses for me.

I’m looking forward to using it to see beneath the surface of the sea. Such lovely rich colours and textures on the sea bed at the water’s edge or in the shallows.

I wish it was possible to use CP filters for macro work. They just cut the light too much but they would be invaluable for shiny insects, especially the black ones. It’s so difficult to control all the reflections on them unless the light is just right.

I definitely agree that an HDR treatment can give some harsh or surreal results. For my landscape work I want to keep the scene looking as natural as possible while at the same time bringing up the details in shadows and keeping the details in the brightly lit areas.

That’s exactly what I’d like to achieve too.

As far as the best software goes, I'm not an expert there. I use PhotoShop CS2 and it has an HDR feature but it doesn't work on my computer for some reason. I purchased Photomatix Light at a reasonable cost and it seems to do the trick for me.

I’ve been reading around since I last wrote and it seems that even in the latest versions of both Photomatix is still the best solution for HDR, being faster and easier to learn apart from a list of other reasons. However, since you use Photomatix I’m already convinced

I shoot RAW. Then I open the file in DPP (Canon's Digital Photo Professional). I process the Raw file into a tiff file three times, one with the exposure decreased by up to 2 stops, one normal and one with the exposure increased by up to 2 stops. I then use those 3 tiff files to create the HDR image.

Ah, now that makes perfect sense! I'll do the same in Lightroom first. I'll be downloading Photomatix later this week and see what I can do.

BTW, Photoshop CS 2 has an HDR capability (but for some reason I've never got it to work on my computer). If you have PS CS5 (or any version from CS2 and up you should be able to use PS to do some HDR work. On CS2 the command is under:
File--> Automate--> Merge to HDR

I'll try that too

Cheers and thanks again,

Kate

 

[Katherine Lihou]

Kate - the good thing about the Live View mode on the Canons - is that it automatically does mirror lock-up for you.

So you don't even have to think about it.

Great to have one less thing to think about. I read too much. I’ve already got a whole crowd of do’s and don’t’s playing ring-a-ring-a-roses in my brain every time I take a photo

The Live View histogram is also unique, in that you can see the histogram 'live', not just between shots - so as you compose the shot and wait for the light to change, you can see how the exposure is effected. It means that you can really fine tune your exposure compensation before taking the shot - really useful.

Sounds great. Definitely going to try it on the landscape shots.

For landscapes it's perfect - for fast targets, not so much!

In macro it sometimes feels as if something racing along at a few millimetres an hour can cause motion blur

Not sure of the best solution for carrying the tripod - I always end up with it over one shoulder, but it sounds like the terrain you have will demand you have both hands free!

You’re right there. I’m a risk-taker but I’m not reckless; the longer you live the more risks you get to enjoy

Maybe someone else has a backback solution that can lock-down a tripod?

I’m not surprised there are no answers so far. I spent ages trying to find one. Plenty that claimed to hold tripods securely but reviewers told a different story. I’ll probably have a go at modifying a rucksack. Just hope I can remember how to use a sewing needle

Thanks again for the help Chris.

Cheers,

Kate

 

[Ralph Thornton]

Kate,
Download Photomatix and give it a go. You don't have to pay for it to try it out. The only thing that will be different is that images will have a Photomatix watermark on them. But I like the idea of try before you buy.

 

[Pete Askew]

There is also a try first option on the Nik software.

http://www.niksoftware.com/hdrefexpro/en/entry.php?

Also: http://www.everimaging.com/

 

[Milan Vjestica]

Hi Kate,

I sometimes us a Vaude Daysack which is essetially a climbing rucksack and has a double strap for an ice axe! It comes in handy to store a walking stick (I have one with shock absorbsion and a camera thread to act as a monopod) or mine can hold a lightweight tripod.

Have a look in an outdoor shop.

 

[Katherine Lihou]

Kate,
Download Photomatix and give it a go. You don't have to pay for it to try it out. The only thing that will be different is that images will have a Photomatix watermark on them. But I like the idea of try before you buy.

Thanks Ralph, so do I I'll try it out very soon.

Cheers,

Kate

 

[Katherine Lihou]

There is also a try first option on the Nik software.

http://www.niksoftware.com/hdrefexpro/en/entry.php?

Also: http://www.everimaging.com/

Thanks for offering the alternatives, Pete. I’ll try them out later

Cheers,

Kate

 

[Katherine Lihou]

Hi Kate,

I sometimes us a Vaude Daysack which is essetially a climbing rucksack and has a double strap for an ice axe! It comes in handy to store a walking stick (I have one with shock absorbsion and a camera thread to act as a monopod) or mine can hold a lightweight tripod.

Have a look in an outdoor shop.

Hello Milan,

Even for a carbon fibre my tripod is probably a bit heavier than the average (lightweight) ice axe, but the double strap could certainly accommodate the length.

But I’ve been thinking over the problem and might just treat myself to a new monopod instead. If I’m out on the rocks it’s usually because there’s a storm in progress and trying to set up a tripod in a force 9 with spray flying everywhere probably isn’t practical

I’ve got a mountaineering friend over here and will ask him where I could find a Vaude Daysack all the same as I need something to carry the rest of the gear in anyway, so many thanks for the thoughtful recommendation.

Cheers,

Kate